APY Lands, Governance

The Hon. T.J. STEPHENS (14:43): I seek leave to make a brief explanation before asking the Minister for Aboriginal Affairs and Reconciliation a question.

Leave granted.

The Hon. T.J. STEPHENS: On 14 November in question time in this place, the minister was asked by the Leader of the Opposition, 'Does the general manager of the APY enjoy the minister's full confidence?' His answer, and I quote, was:

It is not a position that I appoint. It is not a position that I remove. That is not something that is down to me.

Section 13D(4) of the APY Land Rights Act states:

The General Manager will be appointed on conditions (including conditions as to remuneration) determined by the Executive Board with the approval of the Minister and for a term specified in the instrument of appointment and, at the expiration of a term of appointment, is eligible for reappointment.

My questions are:

1. Considering the conditions of appointment for Mr King as general manager, did the minister as pursuant to clause 13D(5) of the APY Land Rights Act question any of the proposed conditions of appointment?

2. Pursuant to clause 13L(2)(b) of the APY Land Rights Act, did the minister approve the appointment of Tania King, wife of the general manager, as Manager of Stakeholder Relations, with an annual salary of almost $210,000?

3. Is the minister able to explain why executive member Murray George suggests that you were 'pushing too much' and 'putting pressure on APY to approve his choice' when the executive were yet to meet with Mr King; and why Chairman, Owen Burton, outlined that failing to 'appoint the Kings, the minister may put in an administrator'?

The Hon. K.J. MAHER (Minister for Employment, Minister for Aboriginal Affairs and Reconciliation, Minister for Manufacturing and Innovation, Minister for Automotive Transformation, Minister for Science and Information Economy) (14:44): I thank the honourable member for his question and for his interest in this area. I know that as a member of the Aboriginal Lands Parliamentary Standing Committee, and having grown up in regional South Australia, he has a deep and ongoing interest in Aboriginal affairs and in the welfare of Aboriginal people in this state, the most disadvantaged segment of our community, who have lived here for tens of thousands of years.

I am sure the honourable member will remind me if I forget any specific part of the question, but I think the first part was in relation to the APY Land Rights Act and the role of the minister to approve the conditions of remuneration. It was some time ago and I will have to double-check, but I am reasonably certain there would have been something I would have had to sign at the time of the appointment, pursuant to the act, to approve the conditions. If that's not the case I will bring back an answer. It would have been a couple of years ago so I will double-check that, but I am reasonably certain that would have been the process that was gone through.

As we know, and as other ministers would know—and having worked for previous Aboriginal affairs ministers I know that this dates back many, many years—this has been one of the difficulties, the limited role the minister has in terms of the functioning of APY. The minister has the power merely to approve terms and conditions, not the power to make appointments in relation to the general manager. The current wording of the act was conceived to allow that self-determination for APY. Not unreasonably, the minister approves terms and conditions, and I am almost certain that at the time I would have signed something to approve it, pursuant to the act, but I will double-check and correct that if not.

In relation to Tania King or any other employee of APY, I have no role in that. The minister has no role in appointments; the minister can't select the general manager, merely approve terms and conditions, pursuant to statute. As the minister, I have no role in the appointment of other employees for APY for any of the administrative functions that APY carries out.

I cannot remember the exact wording, but I think there was a question about some words from Murray George, and I assume they relate to a couple of years ago when he complained he felt pressured or pushed too much to appoint someone. There are difficulties in dealing with such a remote area, where many people have English as a second or third language, although that is not the case with Murray George, who has been around a long time and who was instrumental during the late seventies and early eighties when the land rights act was being pushed for. I have known Murray George for close on two decades, and my experience is that what is quoted, whether that be on social media or other places, is not always the comments you get when you talk to people directly.

About three or four weeks ago, I was in Kaltjiti talking to Murray George, sitting on what regularly substitutes for his office, the steel bench outside the community store in Kaltjiti. I had about an hour sitting down with Murray George talking about a whole range of issues, and I reckon that about 55 minutes of the hour that I spoke with Murray George were on issues relating to community councils and the split of funding between the commonwealth and community councils as opposed to APY service providers—now RASAC, but formerly organisations like the Pitjantjatjara council.

Another part of the conversation revolved around CDEP, the old employment program, and the desire, as Murray George said to me but as many Anangu also said to me, to go back to the way the CDEP program used to be; that is, an employment-based program as opposed to a much more punitive welfare-based program. I reckon for a couple of minutes at the very end Murray George spoke about Mr King, saying that he needed to listen more at meetings.

I know there has been a lot attributed to Mr George and others and their views, but certainly on country, speaking directly to people like Murray George, there are a lot of other issues that are spoken about. I don't remember the comments from a couple of years ago about Murray George making a comment that I was insisting or pushing too hard for someone's appointment. At the end of the day, I don't appoint someone.

At the time that Richard King was appointed interim general manager, my understanding was that it was a unanimous resolution of the board. I understand that after that they employed a recruitment agency based, I think, in Alice Springs to conduct a recruitment for the ongoing position of general manager, but the board decided on Richard King and, as I said, I'm quite sure that at the time I would have approved the conditions.