Attorney-General's Department, $144,739,000

Administered Items for the Attorney-General's Department, $103,603,000

Membership:

Hon. D.G. Pisoni substituted for Mr Patterson.

Mr Teague substituted for Hon. D.J. Speirs.

Mrs Pearce substituted for Mr Brown.

Minister:

Hon. A. Michaels, Minister for Small and Family Business, Minister for Consumer and Business Affairs, Minister for Arts.

Departmental Advisers:

Ms C. Mealor, Chief Executive, Attorney-General's Department.

Mr A. Swanson, Chief Financial Officer, Attorney-General's Department.

Mr M. Dengler, Principal Policy Officer Attorney-General's Department.

Mr F. Stroud, Acting Commissioner, Consumer and Business Services.

Ms R. McPhail, Director, Customer Service and Transformation, Consumer and Business Services.

Ms E. Sims, Acting Director, Regulation and Advice, Consumer and Business Services.

Mr A. Shirole, Manager, Finance, Governance and Reporting, Consumer and Business Services.

The CHAIR: Welcome back, minister. Of course, we have the same minister with her Consumer and Business Services hat on. The proposed payments are open for examination, and I call on the minister to make a further statement, if she wishes, and/or to introduce her advisers.

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: Thank you, Chair. I would like to introduce the advisers around me for the second year in a row. I have the Acting Commissioner, Mr Fraser Stroud, with me on my right, and on my left is Mr Andrew Swanson, Chief Financial Officer of AGD. Behind me I have Emily Sims, Matthias Dengler and Rita McPhail, all from CBS.

I will not make an opening statement, but I would like to acknowledge the contribution of former commissioner Mr Dini Soulio over a number of years for CBS. I want to very much thank Mr Fraser Stroud for his support in recent months, particularly with another round of estimates. I want to acknowledge Mr Martyn Campbell, who will commence in his new role as commissioner later this week. I also want to thank all the department people, particularly behind me Emily Sims, who have done an extraordinary amount of work with a lot of reform happening in the consumer and business services area.

The CHAIR: Thank you, minister. Member for Heysen, I assume you are the lead on this. Do you have an opening statement?

Mr TEAGUE: Thank you, Chair; no opening statement. I will just get to the questions. I have five topics, and if I do not get to all five it will be through lack of time. First is the Casino investigation and related matters, second is Aboriginal associations or associations in respect of Aboriginal communities, third is building industry matters, fourth is tobacco and vaping, and the fifth is gambling revenue—not necessarily in that order. It is all pretty much Budget Paper 4, Volume 1, at pages 46 and 47. There are a couple of other references along the way.

I will start with the Casino investigation, Budget Paper 4, Volume 1, at page 46. Perhaps the first dot point of CBS aims at about point 2 or 3 on the page. I understand Brian Martin AO KC's investigations recently restarted. When can we expect that to be completed and then published?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: We are expecting, by the end of December this year, that investigation to be completed.

Mr TEAGUE: Will that be tabled then, once completed?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: It is a report to the commissioner and I—

Mr STROUD: That should be reported to the minister and then it will be referred to the licensee, which would obviously be SkyCity.

Mr TEAGUE: So will it be published when completed?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: We do not expect it to be so, particularly in light of the confidentiality provisions in the Casino Act at section 19.

Mr TEAGUE: Can we expect the government to have something to say about it at the time that it is completed?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: I would expect the commissioner and I will have something to say at that time.

The CHAIR: Sorry to interrupt your flow, member for Heysen. Could I just ask that you be aware of your directional mics. It is very hard to hear both you and the minister. It is quite difficult to hear.

Mr TEAGUE: I will.

The CHAIR: It could be me, but I am trying to help Hansard.

Mr TEAGUE: In the same vein, when does the government plan to proceed with the legislation to increase casino penalties? My understanding is that was announced and then in pretty quick succession introduced into the parliament at the beginning of May with some urgency. Has that urgency dissipated or is there a plan still to progress with that?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: There is very much a plan to progress with that. It is obviously on the Notice Paper to be proceeded with, I would hope, very soon after the winter break.

Mr TEAGUE: But no particular change of circumstance since introduction?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: Not at all, no. We are very keen to see that progress.

Mr TEAGUE: In relation to Aboriginal incorporated associations that are involving or are for the benefit of Aboriginal communities, how many Aboriginal or Torres Strait Islander groups are governed by associations that are incorporated under the Associations Incorporation Act?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: I am not sure we could answer that. I am not sure that is indicated when an association applies to become an incorporated association, so I am not sure we have that data.

Mr TEAGUE: An example is the Davenport Community Council Incorporated. It is that kind of association that I have in mind. I understand it might not be as simple as a check-box point to identify. Is there any kind of data that the minister could assist the committee with in terms of the number or range of such organisations?

Mr STROUD: I think we would have to take that on notice, Mr Teague, in terms of getting you that information. We incorporate in excess of 20,000 associations. We need to try to ascertain whether there is a manner in which we can seek to clarify whether such an association is based upon Aboriginal or Indigenous association.

Mr TEAGUE: So there is actually nothing that would indicate the nature of an incorporated association in connection with an Aboriginal community unless and until that is unpacked, on the basis of the interests of those involved?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: That is right. I have been on the other end, applying for incorporated associations. I do not recall any sort of question—of course, the acting commissioner would know—when you are applying to be incorporated as an association that would lead us to be able to have that information.

It is very different from, for example, if you are incorporated under the CATSI Act, the federal act, obviously. To be incorporated under the CATSI Act you would need to have that Indigenous connection, but under the Associations Incorporation Act there is nothing specific in the legislation that tackles First Nations associations.

Mr TEAGUE: And nothing, therefore, that provides CBS with any crossover data. You just need to deal with what comes?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: Yes. If there is anything, we are happy to take that on notice, but I do not believe there is.

Mr TEAGUE: I could refer to circumstances in Nepabunna. I have referred to the Davenport community just now. It is a matter I put to the Minister for Aboriginal Affairs last week. The minister has written to a member of the Davenport community saying, 'The concern you raise about governance in the community is related to an incorporated association, so it's not a matter for the Minister for Aboriginal Affairs', even though it is in circumstances where an Aboriginal Lands Trust controlled area is then subleased to the incorporated association and the matter is referred holus-bolus to the minister and to CBS. Is it the case then that those referrals, or matters that are coming up from time to time in that space, are just ad hoc; there is no common connection, therefore, in terms of the data or response from CBS?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: No, they are ad hoc. If there are allegations of breaches of the Associations Incorporation Act, the commissioner will investigate those alleged breaches and provide assistance where the commissioner can.

Mr TEAGUE: Are there any relevant governance supports that CBS is providing presently, and is there any other form of proactive assistance that has arisen from reports in relation to governance where an individual incorporated association is involved? I have in mind DCCI at Davenport, but it may be that there is a general response to the question in relation to proactive supports for incorporated associations.

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: The acting commissioner might want to answer that.

Mr STROUD: Yes, certainly, Mr Teague. In terms of those circumstances that you raised, obviously it is dependent on the nature of the allegations that are brought against a particular association in terms of how CBS responds to perhaps investigating potential breaches under the Associations Incorporation Act.

To your question in terms of support, there is certainly a support network that is in place from CBS. Clearly, if there are circumstances within the nature of the act itself, it is very much an act that is trying to seek and provide support to an association if they are finding there are difficulties in relation to activities that are taking place. That is the way the act is written and founded.

From our perspective, it is a situation where we have on occasions, and we have very recently, been involved in attending events, such as ensuring an annual general meeting is held and the nature of those meetings and the election of people as board members to such committees. So it is very much a proactive approach that is taken from CBS to try to assist an association if there is a sense that they are in some way failing at that particular time.

Mr TEAGUE: I am still at Budget Paper 4, Volume 1, page 46. I refer to targets 2024-25 and the first dot point there, at about point 6 or so on the page. It is a primary target of CBS to provide assistance to consumers seeking to resolve disputes with traders on building industry issues specifically. Can the minister indicate to the committee how many reports, disputes, complaints and notices have been made to CBS in 2023-24 regarding home construction matters where there has been a delay or lack of progress, or works are undertaken but they are materially defective?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: I can give you some broad numbers on inquiries on domestic building issues for the last few years. In this current financial year 2023-24, there have been, until the end of May, 3,945 calls and inquiries on domestic building matters and we are projecting 4,273 for the full financial year. That then leads, potentially, into seeking conciliation assistance and so for the 2023-24 year, the current year that we are in, we have had 417 consumers seeking conciliation assistance. We are projecting that figure to be 452 by the end of the financial year.

If we go back to the year prior, 2022-23, we have had 4,075 calls and inquiries. Obviously it jumped slightly in the current financial year. The number of consumer complaints seeking conciliation assistance was 376, again, a slight increase this year. We obviously then have allegations of breaches of the Building Work Contractors Act coming through. In terms of numbers of complaints on that, for the current financial year up until 31 May, 1,496 with a projection of 1,602 by the end of the financial year. In 2022-23, alleged breaches were a total of 1,155 in that previous year, and lower numbers in the two years prior to that.

Mr TEAGUE: Is there anything in particular to which the minister would attribute that spike in complaints about building companies?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: Some of the issues that we see around the construction industry are that we are seeing issues on staff, workers and seeing a number of building companies expressing concern about finding workers. We obviously had delays through COVID and through HomeBuilder in terms of supplies that were affected. That is still flowing through the system for some of those older contracts. So there has been a range of delays. There are disputes around payments. Of course, people are feeling cost-of-living pressures as well as they are building their homes so are more likely to have disputes around payments and warranty defect claims as well.

Mr TEAGUE: Is the minister observing and, if so, is the minister concerned that there are construction companies and trades that are both struggling to complete existing builds but then taking on fixed-price contracts with consumers? Is there anything that might be done about that as well?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: We obviously have in the budget, and the member would be aware, an additional $1.1 million over the next two years, 2024-25 and 2025-26, to deal with building industry issues. What we are hoping is for those additional resources to provide assistance to consumers to resolve their building disputes and provide more resources in terms of conciliating building disputes between consumers and traders.

We are also using some of that resource to assess complaints on breaches of the Building Work Contractors Act and ACL breaches as well, and investigate any allegations of serious breaches with a view to commencing prosecutions if that is the case. So there are additional staff being committed to in this budget, which will assist with that.

We are also further undertaking work in terms of a review of the building and construction industry with a discussion paper due out shortly, looking at a wholesome review of building and construction industry issues that have been brought to us by industry. Some of those issues have been raised by the commissioner and acting commissioner in recent times so we will certainly be working on making improvements to the building and construction industry regulation, but also being able to support consumers in any disputes that they are having with their builders.

What we are seeing now is certainly an easing off of the substantial price increases that we had seen over HomeBuilder. Building industry associations and building companies have expressed that to me, that that substantial increase in price and therefore the pressure of those fixed price contracts through HomeBuilder has certainly eased, but with labour shortages and cost-of-living pressures, both building companies and consumers are facing those sorts of pressures.

Mr TEAGUE: I think the measure the minister has described is Budget Paper 5 at page 9 and I think that is also narrated at page 47 in terms of that $600,000 investment. How many instruments of agreement have been negotiated by CBS? How many have resulted in the successful completion of home construction and how many of those have failed or otherwise not achieved the desired result?

Mr STROUD: I can indicate that there have been 462 conciliations involved in disputes between consumers and builders. That is between July 2023 and May 2024. But in terms of giving you an indication of instruments of agreement, I would have to take that on notice, I am afraid, Mr Teague.

If I can just add to what the minister commented upon earlier, just to give an indication of the scope of the work that is involved by CBS, we licence 23,000 building work contractors, 6,000 of which are licensed companies and 17,000-plus are licensed individuals, so it is a substantial task for us. What I can say, as the minister has already indicated, is that the percentage uplift in terms of complaints we have had in relation to builders, has obviously had a very big impact on the resourcing of CBS, so the additional funding is very welcome in that regard.

To your question, Mr Teague, in relation to what CBS is doing in terms of moving forward about contracts in relation to builders with current entities, we obviously are facilitating business processes to protect consumers. We have a building triage committee that meets on a weekly basis based on the intel we are receiving and other factors we do by way of desktop searches to try to identify builders who may be in any sort of financial difficulty to have conversations with them.

Ultimately, from our perspective, we do on occasion then seek to obviously meet with such entities and on occasion then consider whether or not it is appropriate to impose a condition which will then prevent that building entity from entering into new contracts in order to try to protect consumers from parting with deposits and the like.

The Hon. D.G. PISONI: I refer to Budget Paper 4, Volume 1, page 46, objectives, the first dot point halfway through the paragraph. It is about complaints of contractors and builders, fair trading and the Australian Consumer Law to ensure fairness of practice and harm minimisation and protect and enhance public trust.

Yesterday, I was contacted by an 80-year-old constituent who had a leak in her home. She got Metropolitan Plumbing to come and they were there for two hours and she received a bill and unfortunately paid a bill for $2,490 plus GST. Once the children saw it, they were obviously outraged at the process. I understand that this is a frustration of the Master Plumbers Association as well. How many of those complaints that you referred to earlier have been from companies like Metropolitan Plumbing?

If you go to websites and social media, you will see there is an alarming number of complaints about the prices and the work that is done. In this instance, the description was to conduct a visual and audio digital water leak investigation for up to one hour, $1,790, and a camera location to inspect a sewer drain, one hour, $890. How many of those types of complaints do you get and what, if any, support are consumers given to rectify this situation?

It seems to be happening in suburbs like—in this instance it was Hyde Park. Fullarton is another suburb where that has happened in my electorate in recent times and I had to deal with it. What are the options for people who feel that they have been either intimidated into paying that money or have been bullied into having the work done? In this instance, after spending the money, they were not even able to identify where the leak was.

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: I am well aware of concerns expressed by some consumers on Metropolitan Plumbing, and I know CBS has been dealing with that particular business or businesses in various forms. I am not sure what the acting commissioner may be able to add to that or not, but of course if you have a constituent who has experienced anything like that, I certainly encourage you or your constituent to get in touch, either through me or directly, with CBS to provide—

The Hon. D.G. PISONI: It is with CBS now. Yesterday, that was sent on by Master Plumbers.

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: Excellent. So I take it that CBS—

The Hon. D.G. PISONI: But I think it is more than just one instance.

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: It is more than one. I do not know what the acting commissioner can or cannot say on that particular organisation.

Mr STROUD: I think it is fair to say in relation to any constituent who has a concern regarding any activity, whether it be a plumber or otherwise, that first and foremost they should contact CBS to have a conversation with an adviser there in relation to the activities that have taken place. That is very much a situation where we try to seek to use the conciliation process if that is deemed appropriate.

To be clear, having the conciliation process in terms of trying to engage with the trader as well as the consumer to try to come to a common ground as to what has happened in relation to matters is one activity. Secondly, if we feel there are any particular breaches in relation to any obligation—for example, in relation to Australian Consumer Law in that sort of instance—then we would obviously look at that from a compliance and enforcement perspective.

The entity you refer to has very much been in the public eye in the past. I think it is fair to say there has been, I believe it was, an episode of the A Current Affair television program which aired in relation to Metropolitan Group. I think over and above that what I can say is that as the minister has indicated we are very much aware of this entity and, without disclosing too much detail, there are more than one complaint, and there are more than one complaint and not only in South Australia.

The Hon. D.G. PISONI: So, minister, would you advise that people who find themselves in that situation should not pay the bill and contact Consumer and Business Services before they take any action?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: We very much encourage consumers to get multiple quotes from licensed builders for any work that needs to be done. Getting those multiple quotes ensures the consumer is aware of what the lowest price is and enables them to make accurate decisions on their finances.

The Hon. D.G. PISONI: I am actually talking about when people receive a bill like this, what is your advice? Should they pay it and then contact CBS or should they not pay it and contact CBS?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: I cannot give legal advice on whether or not there has been a contract formed and whether that payment obligation has arisen. I will not give legal advice, but CBS is available to provide advice to consumers in those situations.

Mr TEAGUE: I might just make particular reference to Budget Paper 4, Volume 1, at page 60 and the table there, 'Additional information for administered items for the Attorney-General’s Department—Statement of cash flows'. Below that is operating activities, cash inflows and taxation, and the first sub-line under taxation is 'Gambling—contribution from gaming machines'. There is an estimated result for 2023-24 of $420,139,000. On my maths that is $18,185,000 or so over the anticipated revenues from gaming machines for the year. Why is that? Why the significant increase over budget?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: Any of those sorts of questions I think need to be directed to the Treasurer. They manage those revenues going into Treasury directly rather than anything that I have the ability to—I cannot answer those questions.

Mr TEAGUE: I am assisted by the answer in that I am conscious that this is an amount that is excluding about $200 million that is betting operations tax, lotteries, casino operations—about $200 million or so that is specifically within the Treasurer's remit, and I think that is set out at Budget Paper 4, Volume 4, page 168, so there is that that is within Treasury. The minister's answer is interesting in the sense that I was about to draw the comparison to a sort of relatively parsimonious amount that is available to CBS to do the sorts of investigative work against this large contribution of taxation of gaming machines. Just how exactly, therefore, is that revenue managed if not—is it just flowing directly to Treasury and nothing to do with CBS at all?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: That is correct.

Mr SWANSON: I will just add that that flows through, as it says at the top of the page, the administered items for the department, so it is basically flow-through revenue. It is collected by CBS and then it is paid over to Treasury to consolidated account.

Mr TEAGUE: I suppose the question might be: why does it not appear in the Treasurer's part of the budget papers in terms of them being able to give an answer as to where the level of that revenue is? Why is it appearing in AGD?

Mr SWANSON: As I said, I think it is appearing here in that the collection of the revenue itself is undertaken by CBS and then it is passed on directly to Treasury to consolidated account. The estimates you are seeing there and the budgeted amounts that are factored into the budget are amounts that are driven by Treasury themselves. We are acting as a bureau, if you like, to collect that revenue on their behalf and, therefore, they would be able to explain some of the unders and overs with it.

Mr TEAGUE: So the minister is unable to indicate where the number for 2024-25 comes from either and why that has, again, significantly increased to $427 million?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: I do not have that information. I think we have seen national trends of increases in gambling revenue but I do not have any information on those specific budgeted items.

Mr TEAGUE: Is there any indication that the minister can give from a CBS point of view as to how much additional gambling quantum that amount of taxation represents? We know that the revenue taken from gambling machines is on a graded basis. Is there anything in terms of CBS's monitoring and analysis that can allow the minister to give an answer as to how much additional gambling relevantly those figures indicate?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: I am advised that, no, we do not.

Mr TEAGUE: Nothing at all?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: No.

Mr TEAGUE: Is there any capacity for the minister, therefore, to give an indication to the committee about a breakdown by venue or suburb or region? Is that within any part of CBS's responsibility?

Mr STROUD: We would be able to look towards what the actual net gaming revenue is towards certain venues, so we could seek to try to work out whether they can be correlated to particular areas, if that is what the nature of the question is.

Mr TEAGUE: Can you take that on notice?

Mr STROUD: Yes, we can.

Mr TEAGUE: How many gaming machines are there in South Australia at present?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: Some 13,000 and something, but we will get a figure. It is in the order of 13,000.

Mr TEAGUE: Can the minister indicate to the committee the total amount that has been gambled through gaming machines in 2023-24?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: Can we take that on notice as well.

Mr TEAGUE: What amount of gaming machine revenue is from gaming machines within the Casino licence?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: Again, we can take that on notice.

Mr TEAGUE: Thank you. In terms of the Casino specifically, what taxation applies to gambling revenue that is raised by the Casino licensee through means other than gaming machines? Is it entirely caught by the category I mentioned earlier that is within the Treasurer's portfolio? This is Budget Paper 4, Volume 4, page 168. How much such revenue is there?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: That is within the Treasurer's realm. I do not have that information. I can advise that net gaming revenue figures are reported in the Auditor-General's Report, which will come out later in the year. That is in terms of net gaming revenue, but in terms of the Casino-specific question I am not sure I am able to answer that, as it sits within Treasury.

Mr TEAGUE: That is with the Treasurer and otherwise we wait for the Auditor-General's Report later in the year?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: Yes.

Mr TEAGUE: Before I come back to the tobacco and e-cigarettes initiative in any time that remains, I might just hand to the member for Frome to ask a bundle of questions.

Ms PRATT: I confirm that I will be reading the omnibus questions, Chair:

1. For each department and agency reporting to the minister, how many executive appointments have been made since 1 July 2023 and what is the annual salary and total employment cost for each position?

2. For each department and agency reporting to the minister, how many executive positions have been abolished since 1 July 2023 and what was the annual salary and total employment cost for each position?

3. For each department and agency reporting to the minister, what has been the total cost of executive position terminations since 1 July 2023?

4. For each department and agency reporting to the minister, will the minister provide a breakdown of expenditure on consultants and contractors with a total estimated cost above $10,000 engaged since 1 July 2023, listing the name of the consultant, contractor or service supplier, the method of appointment, the reason for the engagement and the estimated total cost of the work?

5. For each department and agency reporting to the minister, will the minister provide an estimate of the total cost to be incurred in 2024-25 for consultants and contractors, and for each case in which a consultant or contractor has already been engaged at a total estimated cost above $10,000, the name of the consultant or contractor, the method of appointment, the reason for the engagement and the total estimated cost?

6. For each department or agency reporting to the minister, how many surplus employees are there in June 2024, and for each surplus employee, what is the title or classification of the position and the total annual employment cost?

7. For each department and agency reporting to the minister, what is the number of executive staff to be cut to meet the government's commitment to reduce spending on the employment of executive staff and, for each position to be cut, its classification, total remuneration cost and the date by which the position will be cut?

8. For each department and agency reporting to the minister:

What savings targets have been set for 2024-25 and each year of the forward estimates;

What is the estimated FTE impact of these measures?

9. For each department and agency reporting to the minister:

What was the actual FTE count at June 2024 and what is the projected actual FTE account for the end of each year of the forward estimates;

What is the budgeted total employment cost for each year of the forward estimates; and

How many targeted voluntary separation packages are estimated to be required to meet budget targets over the forward estimates and what is their estimated cost?

10. For each department and agency reporting to the minister, how much is budgeted to be spent on goods and services for 2024-25 and for each year of the forward estimates?

11. For each department and agency reporting to the minister, how many FTEs are budgeted to provide communication and promotion activities in 2024-25 and each year of the forward estimates and what is their estimated employment cost?

12. For each department and agency reporting to the minister, what is the total budgeted cost of government-paid advertising, including campaigns, across all mediums in 2024-25?

13. For each department and agency reporting to the minister, please provide for each individual investing expenditure project administered, the name, total estimated expenditure, actual expenditure incurred to June 2023 and budgeted expenditure for 2024-25, 2025-26 and 2026-27?

14. For each grant program or fund the minister is responsible for, please provide the following information for the 2024-25, 2025-26 and 2026-27 financial years:

Name of the program or fund;

The purpose of the program or fund;

Budgeted payments into the program or fund;

Budgeted expenditure from the program or fund; and

Details, including the value and beneficiary, or any commitments already made to be funded from the program or fund.

15. For each department and agency reporting to the minister:

Is the agency confident that you will meet your expenditure targets in 2024-25?

Have any budget decisions been made between the delivery of the budget on 6 June 2024 and today that might impact on the numbers presented in the budget papers which we are examining today?

Are you expecting any reallocations across your agencies' budget lines during 2024-25; if so, what is the nature of the reallocation?

16. For each department and agency reporting to the minister:

What South Australian businesses will be used in procurement for your agencies in 2024-25?

What percentage of total procurement spend for your agency does this represent?

How does this compare to last year?

17. What protocols and monitoring systems has the department implemented to ensure that the productivity, efficiency and quality of service delivery is maintained while employees work from home?

18. What percentage of your department's budget has been allocated for the management of remote work infrastructure, including digital tools, cybersecurity, and support services, and how does this compare with previous years?

19. How many procurements have been undertaken by the department this FY, how many have been awarded to interstate businesses? How many of those were signed off by the CE?

20. How many contractor invoices were paid by the department directly this FY? How many and what percentage were paid within 15 days, and how many and what percentage were paid outside of 15 days?

21. How many and what percentage of staff who undertake procurement activities have undertaken training on participation policies and local industry participants this FY?

Mr TEAGUE: Just going back to targets 2024-25, the first dot point, the building industry issues on page 46, can the minister indicate how many builders' licences have been removed in the course of last year or taken away, cancelled, and how many have been identified as experiencing financial difficulties?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: We will take the question on notice as to how many have been cancelled or let lapse. On the other question, I am not sure that we are able to provide the advice on how many builders are in financial difficulty, those who have become insolvent and entered into liquidation or—

Mr TEAGUE: Or been the subject of an agreement or other intervention in circumstances where a complaint has been made.

Mr STROUD: We will have to take that on notice in terms of what we feel will be appropriate to be released or otherwise.

Mr TEAGUE: Thank you. Turning then to the initiative in relation to unlawful and illicit tobacco and e-cigarettes and vaping devices, primarily at Budget Paper 4, Volume 1, page 47, it indicates the compliance initiative and FTEs at the bottom of the table at the top of the page, which I understand are largely FTE increases associated with that initiative. The second dot point target on page 46 refers to the implementation of a specialised compliance approach to address what is described as the increasing risk presented by the sale and supply of such products and devices. What is the minister's understanding of the increasing risk—how is that characterised?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: We have seen a surge in the sale of illegal tobacco and e-cigarettes, vapes. Predominantly in the last 12 to 24 months we have seen a substantial increase in the illegal trade of tobacco and vapes, and we have particularly seen a surge in young people, 15 to 29, who are now vaping, using vaping devices, a significant increase in the last few years. It does pose a very substantial health risk. We know that smoking and tobacco is the largest preventable cause of death in Australia still, even though our cigarette smoking rates have been declining over a number of years. I guess this relatively recent increase in vaping and the sale of illegal tobacco we know is a risk.

It was previously within the health department in terms of monitoring those illegal transactions. What we are now doing on 1 July is moving that into CBS, which certainly has the skill set to be able to have a compliance approach that will tackle that increasing sale and supply of unlawful and illegal tobacco and vapes. With the additional staff—$16 million over four years—it will enable CBS to really crack down on licensed suppliers who are selling illegal vapes or illegal tobacco, the ones that are not plain packaged, those illegal imports being sold by licensed traders. Also, we are seeing an increasing number of illegal shops popping up. I received a flyer in my letterbox about an illegal shop a number of months ago and provided that to the health minister at the time and now I get the benefit—

Mr TEAGUE: How many of those shopfronts have been investigated or penalised in the last year?

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: There was a particular—

The CHAIR: If you could be brief, minister, we have reached the allotted time. The member for Heysen managed to slip one by me there.

The Hon. A. MICHAELS: I can see whether we can provide any figures on notice.

The CHAIR: The allotted time has expired. I declare the examination of the portfolio of Consumer and Business Services and the examination of the proposed payments for the Attorney-General's Department and the Administered Items for the Attorney-General's Department complete.

Sitting suspended from 15:47 to 16:00.