Administered Items for the Department of Treasury and Finance, $2,439,548,000

Minister:

Hon. V.A. Tarzia, Minister for Police, Emergency Services and Correctional Services.

Departmental Advisers:

Mr D. Lane, Chief Executive, South Australian Fire and Emergency Services Commission.

Mr J. Schirmer, Principal Financial Analyst, South Australian Fire and Emergency Services Commission.

Ms I. Calabrese, Manager, Financial Services, South Australian Fire and Emergency Services Commission.

Mr C. Beattie, Chief Officer, South Australian State Emergency Service.

Mr B. Eden, Assistant Chief Officer, South Australian Country Fire Service.

Mr M. Morgan, Chief Officer, South Australian Metropolitan Fire Service.

Mr G. Benham, Assistant Chief Fire Officer, South Australian Metropolitan Fire Service.

The CHAIR: The portfolios under examination now are SAFECOM, SA Country Fire Service, SA Metropolitan Fire Service and the State Emergency Service. The minister appearing is the Minister for Police, Emergency Services and Correctional Services. I declare the proposed portfolios open for examination. Minister, would you like to introduce your advisers, please?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: Chair, the clock is ticking, so in the spirit of good governance I am happy to kick off, if the member for Lee is happy with that?

The CHAIR: Would you like to make an opening statement, minister?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I will make a brief opening statement, if I may, Chair. Firstly, I would like to introduce the very hardworking staff in the room—the officers who are in the room with me this morning—and then make some very brief opening remarks.

First to my left is Dom Lane, Chief Executive of SAFECOM. Immediately behind me is Joel Schirmer, Principal Financial Analyst at SAFECOM. To Joel's left is Iolanda Calabrese, Manager, Financial Services at SAFECOM. Behind Iolanda and Joel is Chris Beattie, Chief Officer, SES. Then we have Brenton Eden, Assistant Chief Officer, CFS; Mr Michael Morgan, Chief Officer, MFS; and Glenn Benham, Assistant Chief Fire Officer of the MFS.

Mr Chairman, as we consider today the 2020-21 budget papers as they relate to the emergency services sector, from the outset it is important that we acknowledge the volunteers and staff of our emergency services organisations who are always ready to respond to emergency incidents often putting themselves in harm’s way as they help the community in times of need.

It is also important as we head into a new bushfire season that we reflect on the 2019-20 bushfire season that significantly impacted communities on Kangaroo Island, the Adelaide Hills, the South-East, Yorke Peninsula and other parts of the state. Of course, these fires burnt almost 280,000 hectares, destroying 196 homes, 892 other buildings, 660 vehicles were destroyed or damaged, almost 68,000 livestock perished, and tragically we lost three people as well.

The response effort by the emergency services sector was enormous, with CFS, MFS and SES personnel putting in weeks of extended effort to contain the fires, having already assisted Queensland and New South Wales with major fires. I also acknowledge the many others involved in the response effort, including the Australian Defence Force, the Department for Environment and Water, ForestrySA, SAPOL, local government, farm firefighting units and others from the community who provided support.

Following the fires, the government acted quickly, engaging former Australian Federal Police Commissioner, Mr Mick Keelty AO, to lead an independent review of how the state responded and what lessons could be applied for future bushfire seasons. The review's report was released in July 2020, and the government's initial response consisted of an allocation of $20.3 million as part of a $48.5 million package for SA's emergency services. A comprehensive response to the review was released in September 2020, providing a further $49 million bringing that total of additional funding to $97.5 million to create a safer and more bushfire resilient South Australia.

The budget papers we are examining today identify new funding for the emergency services sector to address the findings of the independent review, including:

$11.5 million for the replacement of MFS heavy urban pumpers;

$7.2 million for the accelerated replacement of CFS single-cabin fire trucks with safer dual-cabin fire trucks;

$5 million for AVL systems for emergency services vehicles, to improve safety for personnel and improve incident management information;

$4.7 million for nine additional regional CFS staff, including a dedicated officer for Kangaroo Island;

$4 million to continue improvements and upgrades to CFS stations and incident management facilities;

$2.7 million to retrofit fire truck safety systems to additional vehicles;

$2.5 million to support the upgrade of the national Emergency Alert voice and text message alert capability;

$2.1 million for four additional CFS staff to support the operation of the State Bushfire Coordination Committee;

$1.5 million for three additional CFS staff, to support the introduction of the Australian Fire Danger Rating system; and

$600,000 to increase mental health and wellbeing support to the emergency services sector.

Major bushfires are on top of the other incidents that the sector responds to, including vehicle accidents, building fires, storm damage and other emergencies. I again want to thank our first responders for all that they do.

Of course, this sector has also had to manage the impact of COVID-19, and they have implemented modified arrangements to maintain their response capability as well. They have also been assisting Health and police. Again, I place on record my thanks to the volunteers and the staff of the emergency services sector. With that introduction, I welcome questions from members present.

The CHAIR: Thank you, minister. Member for Elizabeth did you want to make a statement?

Mr ODENWALDER: I have just a very brief opening statement. I also want to acknowledge the work of the agencies, the workers and volunteers, particularly over last summer.

At the beginning of the year, in February, I thought that this year would be entirely consumed or dominated by discussion about bushfires, climate change and those associated things but, of course, COVID hit. Of course, that work has been going on and, as the minister said, the Keelty review brought down its findings on the Royal Commission into National Natural Disaster Arrangements, which have been met at length. I tried to follow that as closely as I could, including submissions from the agencies here. That work does continue and it is important work, and I want to acknowledge all the work, both last summer and in preparation for this summer, that the agencies have done.

May I also say that we have referenced both the Keelty review and the royal commission, and I hope that we can in the course of our conversation take those as given and not continually have to refer to page numbers and things. I hope that is acceptable to the minister.

The CHAIR: Well, let's see how we go with that, member for Elizabeth. Could you reference a budget line now, please.

Mr ODENWALDER: I want to go to Budget Measures Statement, Budget Paper 5, page 47, which references the changes to the SAFECOM Board: the appointment or the proposed appointment of an independent chair. Minister, can you outline how you arrived at the decision to establish an independent chair of SAFECOM?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I thank the member for Elizabeth for the question. Obviously, we were the first jurisdiction in all of Australia to commission an independent bushfire review, the Keelty review—a great review, and I encourage all members to read it. It made a number of recommendations. One of those was in regard to the SAFECOM structure, if you like.

We considered the independent bushfire review, and obviously the government accepted the recommendations of that review. I would like to say that this year, but if not this year then certainly early next year, we will be looking to introduce legislation to move towards creating an independent chair for SAFECOM.

Mr ODENWALDER: Is there any other legislation in the pipeline aimed at altering the way the SAFECOM Board is structured?

Mr CREGAN: Point of order, Chair: a discussion about a government's future policy does not relate to any budget line item. Clearly there are other forums for questions of that type, many other forums. This forum is to examine this budget.

The CHAIR: I uphold the point of order again. Member for Elizabeth, you are asking the minister about any future legislation the government might have. Obviously the minister can answer in whatever way he chooses, but it is not reasonable to ask that question in this forum.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: Chair, with your indulgence and in the spirit of trying to be helpful and beneficial, it probably does not have a budget line item, but I am happy to be helpful to the member for Elizabeth. I think it is an important question so, with your indulgence, I am able to answer this one.

The CHAIR: That is entirely up to you, if you would like to give us information on it.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I thank the member for Elizabeth for the question. Without breaching the rule of anticipation—I note the Clerk would be hot on your heels there, Chair—I believe that one of the other recommendations in the Keelty review was around the State Bushfire Coordination Committee reporting to parliament. I suggest that again, if not late this year then early next year, the government would also be in a position to introduce legislation to give effect to that so that the State Bushfire Coordination Committee would report to the parliament. I think that is a good thing.

The CHAIR: That is a good result, isn't it, member for Elizabeth? Minister, thank you for your openness.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: That is the only legislation I am aware of at this point.

Mr ODENWALDER: Will the new model mean that the CE of SAFECOM also gets to sit on the board but will not chair it? Is that the way it is structured? So there will be one more member? Mr Lane is nodding, if you want to save some time.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I believe that is the intention; however, obviously we will have to see what the final legislation looks like. That will be debated in this place at a future date—and I tell you what, I would even be happy to provide the member for Elizabeth with a briefing, just as I have tried to be very helpful and provide him with a briefing on GLS legislation, which I know he has also had.

Mr ODENWALDER: That is another conversation. Has the intention to create an independent chair been put to the SAFECOM Board, and was it unanimously endorsed?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: There was obviously an independent review commissioned by the Premier. That independent review reported to cabinet and the government has released its response. That is what I am advised.

Mr ODENWALDER: So it has not been put to the SAFECOM Board? That is all I asked, and whether the board endorsed it. If it does not have to, it does not have to.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: The independent review has been reported to the SAFECOM Board.

Mr ODENWALDER: Yes, well, it is public. Minister, have you read the report prepared by Mr Lane in September of last year, entitled Analysis of South Australia's Fire and Emergency Services?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: What budget line, sorry?

Mr ODENWALDER: The same budget line, or we can have Budget Paper 3, Volume 2, page 72, SAFECOM governance. It states:

SAFECOM performs the following functions…develops and maintains a strategic and policy framework across the emergency services sector

I am asking the minister if he has read the publication, Analysis of South Australia's Fire and Emergency Services, prepared by the CE.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I think so. I think we are talking about a document that was commissioned by the previous minister. What I would say is that since that we have obviously implemented a number of things, one of them being our response to the Keelty review. There has also been a royal commission, so I would probably, respectfully, want to more focus on those things. There is a whole range of things that happened before I was a minister. That was commissioned by the previous minister. It may have been in my induction pack; it would have been in my induction pack. I am sure I read it some three and a bit months ago.

Mr ODENWALDER: I am not going to ask you to quote it, minister, I just wonder if you have read it.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: With everything else. I thank the team behind me who provided me with much, much reading in the incoming brief, so I am sure it was in there and I am sure I would have read it, yes.

Mr ODENWALDER: One of the recommendations was the establishment of a joint executive charter, where the chief executive and chief officers commit as a unified team when presenting at the SAFECOM Board to allow government priorities, improvements and changes to be implemented into operational policy. Has this executive charter been enacted or signed by the relevant parties?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I am advised that there certainly was a charter that had been signed in collaboration with the previous minister, but since that time I am advised that the charter has been withdrawn, and all chief officers and the CE have certainly demonstrated what I would call a willingness to move past that; consequently, it has also been removed from the SAFECOM website. It was a charter signed in collaboration with the previous minister.

Mr ODENWALDER: Can you clarify what you mean by 'withdrawn'? This is a document signed by five parties that I am aware of. Can you explain what you mean by 'withdrawn'? What is the legal status of that charter first?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I am advised the document was signed in the spirit of collaboration rather than having a legal status, if you like. The CFSVA certainly raised with the CE of SAFECOM their concerns of a conflict regarding governance and, in the spirit of collaboration, the CE of SAFECOM has removed the document from the website.

Mr ODENWALDER: When the document was enacted before it was withdrawn, did it in practice mean that the CE and the three chief officers presented as a unified block to the SAFECOM board—in other words, they would vote together?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: No, it does not mean that.

Mr ODENWALDER: So what does it mean? There is a document that has been signed by five people that, according to you, has no legal standing and does not compel anybody to do anything. Is it just an understanding?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: It was signed in the spirit of collaboration and it was commissioned by the former minister.

Mr ODENWALDER: It was commissioned by the former minister.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: He would have agreed to it. It was done during his time, not mine. I am advised that it has no legal status and it was signed in the spirit of collaboration. As I said, the CFSVA raised with the CE of SAFECOM their concerns regarding a potential conflict of governance and, in the spirit of collaboration, the CE of SAFECOM has removed it from the website.

Mr ODENWALDER: Surely normal governance would dictate that there is a board with—I cannot remember how many—perhaps nine or 10 members, all with a vote should that be the case. I understand most of these decisions are made unanimously but, should there be a vote, there are nine people who can exercise that vote. This document at least suggested that those people would work together in a collaborative way, as you say. Surely that is against the spirit of the way in which boards are generally constructed.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I would respectfully say we are probably moving into argument now.

The CHAIR: I am going to ask for a point of clarification from the minister. You said the document has been withdrawn.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: Yes.

The CHAIR: Is that simply withdrawn from the website?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: Yes.

The CHAIR: But it is still in place?

Mr ODENWALDER: The Chair is asking questions.

The CHAIR: I just need some clarification here so I can understand where the questioning is going.

Mr ODENWALDER: Indeed. I am with you.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I am advised—if I can be helpful here, and I think I know what we are getting to—the charter in no way directed anyone to do anything regarding decisions as board members. That is my advice.

The CHAIR: Thank you.

Mr ODENWALDER: So why did it need to be put in place?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: That could be hypothetical.

Mr ODENWALDER: No, it is not hypothetical; it is a question.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: If something needed to be done or did not need to be done is a matter of conjecture.

Mr ODENWALDER: Why was it put in place? That is not hypothetical.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: It probably does not relate to a budget line.

Mr ODENWALDER: If it does not do anything, why was it put in place?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: Respectfully, we have said three, maybe four times that it was a document, it had no legal status and it was signed in the spirit of collaboration.

Mr ODENWALDER: So it was a pointless document that did not do anything and at some point it has been withdrawn. Have all the signatories to it agreed to its withdrawal, including the previous minister?

The CHAIR: Member for Elizabeth, the current minister is not in a position to speak for the previous minister.

Mr ODENWALDER: No, but he can tell me whether the previous minister has consented to withdraw that document. He does not have to speak on his behalf.

The CHAIR: I do not know whether the current minister is in that position or not and he can answer that as he sees fit.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I could take that on notice but, like you said, Chair, the former minister is not here right now.

The CHAIR: No, and you are not responsible for any decisions made.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I am definitely not responsible for his decisions.

Mr ODENWALDER: We will move on then, but on the same budget line. Do you agree with Mr Lane's assertion in this review:

It is evident that [there] has been a lack of trust between the emergency services and with SAFECOM. Fire and Emergency Services also need to build the trust and confidence of Government…

That was in the analysis you might have looked at.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: The way I would answer that, Chair, is to remind the member respectfully that the document has been withdrawn and that the focus of the government is certainly on implementing the recommendations of the Keelty review, which we continue to do. Of course, we also have a recent royal commission that has handed down its findings. Rather than look back, I think we should look forward.

The government is undertaking a number of positive moves in this area. As I said, the document referred to was commissioned during the time of the former minister. I am the minister now. I think we have moved on from that. There are plenty of lines in the budget to talk about. I do not think I can really add anything further.

The CHAIR: Given that the member for Narungga is one of the members in this place whose electorate experienced a bushfire last summer, I will go to him for a question.

Mr ELLIS: To that specific end, I would like to refer to Budget Paper 4, Volume 2, investing expenditure summary, automatic vehicle location system. That was something that popped up in the wash up of the Yorketown fire and the fires near Port Wakefield as being vitally needed to improve CFS services. I wonder if you might update this committee on its implementation and how it is tracking.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: Yes, certainly. Thank you for the question on Budget Paper 4, Volume 2, page 71, automatic vehicle location technology. This technology is going to be an absolute game changer. A version of AVL already exists in the MFS. Automatic vehicle location (AVL) technology will certainly be a game changer for the CFS and greatly improve the safety of crews in dangerous situations. I pay tribute to the member for Narungga and the great people of Yorke Peninsula. I have been able to visit them twice already as the local member. I commend all the volunteers for the great work they do.

As the member would know, there was a review into the 2019-20 state bushfire season that we would implement AVL technology for our crews. It is not the first time the implementation has been recommended. The independent review noted—and it is indeed disappointing—that it had not been implemented after the Pinery bushfires in 2015, five years yesterday.

Finally, thanks to our government, AVL technology will be implemented so that we have real-time tracking of CFS crews, enabling more effective situations for deployments. Importantly, AVL will be an invaluable tool in monitoring and improving the safety of our CFS crews as well. It is beyond belief, in my opinion, that we can see Uber Eats delivered in real time but the CFS has been unable to see exactly where a crew is positioned, whether they are safe, whether they could be better positioned elsewhere. It is incumbent upon us to do all we can in this regard.

In terms of our progress on the rollout of AVL technology, expressions of interest have been received and they are currently being assessed. Field trials will be conducted over the summer in the following regions—and I am pleased to say that Yorke Peninsula is one of those, the member for Narungga will be happy to know—Kangaroo Island, Coober Pedy, the West Coast and the South-East. Following the trial, we will also begin the necessary preparations for a full rollout late next year.

I really cannot stress enough how much of a difference this will make to the capabilities of the CFS. When you get out there and talk to some of the brigades, there is so much passion; they cannot wait for it to be rolled out. Of course, it is part of our $97.5 million response to the independent review, which will ensure that our emergency services agencies have the tools and resources they need to protect lives and property.

Mr ODENWALDER: I would like to return to Budget Paper 3, Volume 2, page 72, on that similar line of questioning. Was the minister consulted before the charter was withdrawn or the analysis document was removed from the website?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: Sorry, that was Budget Paper?

Mr ODENWALDER: It was Budget Paper 3, Volume 2, page 72. Were you consulted before the charter was withdrawn and before the analysis was taken off the website?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I have been advised that it was removed at the request of CEs and VAs in the spirit of collaboration. My office was advised after it occurred. Since becoming the minister, one of the obvious things to me is that a number of reviews have been done in relation to emergency services. I do not want in any way, shape or form to be political here, but we have been in government for two and a bit years and we are seeing some great things happen in this portfolio.

I think it is really important to remember our purpose and what we are here to do. We are here to protect lives, protect property, protect the environment and get on with the job of keeping people safe this bushfire season, for example. There is some great stuff happening in this portfolio—projects like AVL and projects like the new headquarters. There is no doubt that in the past there have been, if you like, some disagreements, perhaps even a deviation of opinions between certain forces.

Can I tell you that I have never seen them closer. They are all working well together. Whilst some people may disagree from time to time, overall our MFS, CFS and all our other emergency services are working well together and doing great things. As I said, we are rolling out AVL and we are getting on with the job of delivering on the Keelty review and the new headquarters with all the services in the same building. It is a great thing.

In the past, there have been many reviews. In fact, there have been many ministers. Sir, you could go back and find out how many ministers were in this portfolio during the 16 years of Labor government. I think this is one of the things that we should look to change. If the member for Elizabeth in the long-term future, maybe decades down the track, becomes the Minister for Emergency Services, I hope he remembers that there was a long list of ministers in this space. I certainly do not think that was a good thing. If a minister can have continuity and work with the various organisations for a longer period of time, that would bode well. We can focus on the past or we can move forward and focus on the future. I think we should focus on the future.

The CHAIR: Member for Elizabeth, your career has just been extended decades down the track.

Mr ODENWALDER: It has. I think I will be 76 by the minister's reckoning. The question remains, though. To clarify, because that answer was a little obtuse, you were not consulted before the executive charter was withdrawn. You were told about it after; is that right?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: As I have alluded to, this was a document signed during the course of the previous minister's time. I am advised that at the request of the VAs the document was withdrawn. My office was advised afterwards.

Mr ODENWALDER: You had no role in that decision-making to withdraw the executive charter, other than simply to acknowledge it after it happened?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I was advised afterwards.

Mr ODENWALDER: I will move on to Budget Paper 4, Volume 2, page 45, and I know you will want to talk about this. This is about the general purpose pumper funding for the MFS. To my mind, this forms the only new spending for the MFS in this budget. Is it in fact money that was already budgeted for fleet replacement in the forward estimates that was brought forward?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: Budget Paper 5, page 45?

Mr ODENWALDER: Budget Paper 5, is it? My apologies.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: That is alright; I am trying to help. This is all new money: $2 million this year and $3 million next year. This is new money, I am advised.

Mr ODENWALDER: We have talked a bit about the Keelty review. The Keelty review observes that 'there is an urgent need to review the age and appropriateness' of bushfire fleets across the services, ensuring all vehicles are fitted with burnover protection, etc. How many appliances does the MFS currently have and how many will it have at 30 June 2021, the end of the financial year?

The CHAIR: Member for Elizabeth, it has not been my practice to take questions from the government side, but in a moment I am going to take one from the member for Kavel in the same spirit that I took one from the member for Narungga, in that their electorates were affected by bushfires last summer. I will do that after the minister's response.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: There were 115 at 30 June 2020.

Mr ODENWALDER: How many now—presumably 130?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: There were 115 and four are on order, and we are expecting delivery of them before the end of the year. COVID has also slowed that process, as the member would probably appreciate.

The CHAIR: Member for Elizabeth, did you want to pursue that line of questioning before I go to the member for Kavel?

Mr ODENWALDER: Indeed I would, yes. You can correct me if I am wrong, but I am advised that about 30 per cent are older than 15 years in service. Can you advise how many fire appliances are older than 20 years and how many are older than 30 years that are still operational in MFS and, if you can, what percentage of those are in regional areas? This will interest perhaps the member for Kavel and others.

The CHAIR: Is Kavel regional? I can ask—

Mr CREGAN: Yes.

Mr ODENWALDER: More regional than Elizabeth.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: Member for Elizabeth, I have some figures here to be helpful. I might need to take some on notice, but what I can tell you is that under 10 years old there are 33 appliances, and that includes hook lifts; between the ages of 10 and 20, there are 53 appliances, and this includes hook lifts and ICV; and over 20 years there are 19 appliances, and this includes hook lifts, bulk water carriers and Brontos.

I have had the pleasure to inspect their kit and I thank the various brigades around the state who have allowed me to do so. It is safe to say that all are very happy with this $97.5 million. It has been well received and very welcome. There is no doubt that, without being overly political, after 16 years of the former government, much more should have been done. We are getting on with the job. We understand there is much more to do and we will continue to upgrade the fleet. I think what you will see is that under our government the average age will reduce on the whole, hopefully not increase. It certainly will not increase as it did under the former government.

The CHAIR: Any further questions on that—

Mr ODENWALDER: Well, yes. If everyone is so pleased, why then is the United Firefighters Union writing to the Treasurer asking the Marshall government to take their concerns seriously and allocate much more funding? They have pointed to the MFS currently not having enough spare fire trucks to cover breakdowns and maintenance. If you look at the performance indicators, you can see that the intention is 80 per cent of the time to maintain a fleet reserve capability of two appliances. This is only being met 30 per cent of the time in the last financial year. It points to at least some firefighters not being particularly happy with the current state of the MFS resourcing or with the allocation in this budget.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: Comments of the UFU, I have been asked to respond to, sir. I am happy to respond to comments of the UFU. I do not think there is a budget line on them, but I am happy to respond to them. I have been asked to talk to the comments raised by the UFU. Those comments were quite broad. There are many of them, so I am happy to respond to those.

Mr ODENWALDER: No, I pointed specifically to the number of spare fire trucks and the fact that the target is to maintain a fleet reserve capability of two appliances 80 per cent of the time, but last year that was only met 30 per cent of the time.

Mr CREGAN: Point of order, Mr Chairman: the member for Elizabeth just cannot have it both ways. He wants to have the most expansive form of questioning known to parliament, and you have been very indulgent and we have been very indulgent—

Mr ODENWALDER: I was quite specific about those numbers, member for Kavel.

Mr CREGAN: I am making my point of order. There has been quite some latitude extended to you, member for Elizabeth, but much of your questioning does offend standing order 97. The minister is now going to answer in a very expansive fashion and generously to you and you are still complaining, even in advance of his answer. It is extraordinary.

Mr ODENWALDER: With respect, Chair, you are not complaining. I do not know why he is saying this to you—

The CHAIR: With respect to the committee members, we are not going to have a conversation across the chamber about this. The member for Elizabeth has asked his question. The minister has agreed to answer it, and I remind members here that ministers can choose to answer questions in whichever way they wish. Following your answer, minister, we are going to go to the member for Kavel for his question.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I say at the outset that I am very happy to work with the union. I think there is a very good place for the UFU in advocating for their members and I welcome that. I have met with the UFU twice since being the new minister. I was of the view that those talks were certainly positive and I am still happy to meet with the UFU down the track. I will address many of the issues that have been raised—and I imagine other issues will be raised—in regard to this line of questioning. I am happy to put some facts on the record, in the interests of being helpful.

It is important to note that the MFS has certainly been successful in obtaining funding for a number of specific projects. In terms of new appliances, I am advised there are four new heavy urban general pumpers. These will be strategically stationed within the metropolitan area and will provide enhanced response capability. I am also told they will carry 2,500 litres of water and rescue equipment and employ burnover protection systems, which is very important, especially when those crews go out into our country areas, sir, as you, the member for Narungga, the member for Kavel, maybe even the member for Davenport and definitely the member for Giles would appreciate too. It is important.

We have to do much more in this area and we are getting on with the job. They were due to be completed, but, as I said, production has certainly been delayed. The world has changed. Try to order something online at the moment and you are waiting because COVID-19 has affected things. I am not here to play politics on this issue. We know they need more equipment and we are getting on with the job. We are trying to deliver that. We want our men and women to have the tools that they need to keep themselves safe and also South Australians safe, so I am not playing any games in regard to that front.

There are an additional 11 replacement appliances over four years, eight of which were ordered in October 2020. They will be a combination of heavy urban general pumpers and/or heavy urban rescue. These appliances will all be fitted with burnover protection systems, which is a good thing. The MFS is currently awaiting confirmation of the expected delivery time of that as well. You also have new helmets and breathing apparatus.

There are learnings from interstate. From every new fire and every large catastrophe, we learn something. In applying those learnings from interstate, the MFS postponed selections of new helmets until a decision on BA had been determined. That is important, as it had been identified by some of our colleagues interstate that the interface between the physical positioning of the BA with some helmet selections created issues; for example, it knocked against one and, on another, at the base of the neck. You cannot have that happening. BA selection has been finalised, I am advised, and the supplier, MSA, has been engaged for the provision of 420 sets of BA.

I have spoken about burnover protection systems on appliances. The MFS is committed to fitting burnover protection systems on a total of 64 appliances. To date, 33 appliances have had burnover protection systems fitted in advance of the coming fire season. A total of 31 appliances are still required to be fitted with burnover protection systems. One is currently in the workshop being fitted out and a further two have been scheduled.

Of course, we have also had this lockdown. I am sure that has not helped things, but we are working as hard as we can. I can also talk about wet weather gear. I am cognisant of the time. If the EB does come up, what I would say is that obviously negotiations for the new enterprise agreement are continuing and the member for Elizabeth would appreciate that that is with the Department of Treasury and Finance. I understand that discussions are ongoing. I have met with the UFU twice in my three or so months as a minister and I am happy to keep meeting them, even when we might respectfully disagree on things. My door will be open.

Mr CREGAN: I was going to take the minister to Budget Paper 4, Volume 2, page 58, to ask the minister to provide some additional detail on the resources and equipment being provided to the MFS, but the minister very helpfully has just given useful additional detail to matters I had in my mind. I would like to ask the minister if there are additional matters that he might be able to provide to the committee in relation to resources to the CFS as well.

The CHAIR: Please ask your question, member for Kavel.

Mr CREGAN: Minister, thank you very much for the information you have provided in terms of the MFS. As you know, there is a new retained fire service in Mount Barker. I am very grateful for that commitment and I know my community is appreciative. I would appreciate an update on the transition to those services and, of course, any additional resources being provided to the CFS.

The CHAIR: Is that Mount Barker specifically, or is it more general?

Mr CREGAN: In relation to the retained service at Mount Barker and in relation to the CFS surrounding services. But, as the minister knows, there is also a CFS brigade in Mount Barker.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: Additional resources for Mount Barker and also the CFS?

Mr CREGAN: Yes.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I am advised that the MFS and the CFS continue to work together for the Mount Barker area and also the greater Mount Barker area. The member would appreciate that the MFS retained fire station at Mount Barker became operational on 1 July 2019. Funding has been provided for that initiative for 2019-20 of $697,000; in 2020-21, $2.461 million; and, for 2021-22, $726,000. They will continue to work with the CFS. I am also informed that they work with two additional MFS appliances, and they will continue to work in a cooperative fashion with the CFS as well.

Mr ODENWALDER: I just want to return to those performance indicators, which are at Budget Paper 4, Volume 2, page 58. Given that there is an urgent need to review the age and appropriateness of the fleet—that is what Keelty advised—and given that, according to these budget papers, fleet reserve capability is only being met 30 per cent of the time rather than the targeted 80 per cent, would it not be reasonable for people to worry that going into the fire season the MFS may not be as prepared as it should be or could be? Further to that, can the minister assure this committee that the MFS will be able to meet its operational level of preparedness every day this fire season?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: The answer to your last question is yes, and the first question—

Mr ODENWALDER: Yes, it is reasonable for people to worry that the MFS may not be as prepared as it should be?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: And they will meet its operational—

Mr ODENWALDER: You can assure us that the MFS will be able to meet its operational level of preparedness every day this fire season? That is what you are assuring the committee?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: They have committed to surge-resilient appliances this year. I understand they are fully stowed with equipment, and that is certainly an advancement on last year. This is in addition to the factors I have alluded to in terms of new money, Keelty and $97.5 million. There is a lot of new stuff in there. Whilst you can never completely eliminate risk out there, in many regards we are certainly doing much more than we have ever done before.

Mr ODENWALDER: I refer to Budget Paper 4, Volume 2, page 61, MFS expenditure. Late last year, the previous minister announced the review into the MFS expenditure, and I apologise if I have missed this under the cloud of COVID, but was that review ever completed?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I am advised that a draft has been completed, member for Elizabeth.

Mr ODENWALDER: A draft has been completed? Why is it taking so long?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: These things take time. It is a thorough review, I imagine.

Mr ODENWALDER: That is your answer: 'These things take time'?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I will see if I can have more to elaborate on.

Mr ODENWALDER: It is 13 months old.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I am not trying to be facetious.

The CHAIR: The minister will seek advice.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I will have take it on notice in terms of specifics and perhaps a likely time frame, member for Elizabeth. I think that is what you are getting to: when will it be done?

Mr ODENWALDER: Yes.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I will take that on notice.

Mr ODENWALDER: You cannot tell me what this review is going to recommend? Have you seen a copy of the draft report?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I will take it on notice, as I said, member for Elizabeth. Lots of documents were included in my incoming minister's brief. If there was a draft review and it was in there, I do not want to mislead you or the house, so I am happy to take that on notice. But it is a draft review.

Mr ODENWALDER: At the time, the former minister said, and I quote, that the new MFS chief at the time, Michael Morgan, 'had identified problems on his appointment' leading to the review and he was 'determined to address them'. Can you tell me what those problems were and do they still exist?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: Which budget line?

Mr ODENWALDER: Budget Paper 4, Volume 2, page 61.

The CHAIR: Once again, the member for Elizabeth is asking questions relating to the previous minister.

Mr ODENWALDER: With respect, Chair, I am asking questions about MFS expenditure. There is a review into the MFS expenditure.

The CHAIR: Yes, I understand that, but your question was what were the concerns of the previous minister.

Mr ODENWALDER: No, my questions were what were the concerns of the MFS chief Michael Morgan, who is sitting behind the minister right now.

The CHAIR: That is not my recollection of your question. Anyway, the minister appears as though he is preparing to answer.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: I certainly do not want to begin a precedent, but I am trying to be as helpful as possible—

The CHAIR: I understand that.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: —and the government only has an hour for this agency. I will see what I can do. Member for Elizabeth, to be as helpful as possible, referring to Agency Statement, Volume 2, page 61, I am advised the feedback was in regard to more allocation of funding for the line in 2019-20 that was $104.743 million. That has been addressed in the 2020-21 budget for salaries, wages, annual and sick leave, where you see that amount has increased. The feedback was about that budget line, and that has been addressed and increased in the 2020-21 budget. That is my helpful advice, but I am not responsible for the former minister and what he said.

The CHAIR: As we have already determined, minister. A final question, member for Elizabeth.

Mr ODENWALDER: I refer to Budget Paper 4, Volume 2, page 54, targets, referring to the Bushfire Royal Commission. Recommendation 5.1 was about making provision for a declaration of a state of emergency, essentially giving the federal government certain powers to declare a state of emergency. I am wondering if the minister supports this recommendation.

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: Obviously that report was handed down a matter of weeks ago. I understand that all states and territories are considering the report. They will be providing a response in due course and the government will certainly keep the public notified of their response to that and any other recommendation.

Mr ODENWALDER: So there is no time line to respond?

The Hon. V.A. TARZIA: It is still early days.

The CHAIR: Thank you, minister. Having reached the allotted time, I declare the examination of the proposed payments for SAFECOM, the CFS, the MFS, the SES and the Administered Items for the Department of Treasury and Finance to be complete.

Sitting suspended from 10:31 to 10:45.