House of Assembly Fifty-Fifth Parliament, First Session (55-1) 55 1 Parliament of South Australia House of Assembly published Question Time Question Time Hydrogen Power Plant Hydrogen Power Plant The Hon. D.J. SPEIRS House of Assembly Black Leader of the Opposition Hydrogen Power Plant The Hon. D.J. SPEIRS (Black—Leader of the Opposition) (14:08): My question is to the Premier. Will the hydrogen power station reduce power prices for South Australian households and businesses and, if so, by how much? With your leave, sir, and that of the house, I will explain. Leave granted. The Hon. D.J. SPEIRS House of Assembly Black Leader of the Opposition The Hon. D.J. SPEIRS: At a Budget and Finance Committee hearing earlier this year, the chief executive of the Office of Hydrogen Power SA, Mr Sam Crafter, was asked on 23 separate occasions whether Labor's $600 million hydrogen power plant would lower household electricity bills, and on each occasion he responded that, and I quote, 'The targeted objective of this power plant is to lower prices for industrial customers.' The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS House of Assembly West Torrens Minister for Infrastructure and Transport Minister for Energy and Mining The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS (West Torrens—Minister for Infrastructure and Transport, Minister for Energy and Mining) (14:09): As we have always said, renewable energy is a cheaper option than thermal energy. Wholesale power prices inform retail power prices, but they don't impact retail prices day to day. What we are attempting to do is obviously firm renewable energy by offering a new generator into the system. The unfortunate consequence of the history of the National Electricity Market in South Australia is that every time we build capacity within the NEM it is privatised by members opposite. We build new capacity they attack it and say that it is experimental, unnecessary, whatever it might be, and what— Members interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Order! The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS House of Assembly West Torrens Minister for Infrastructure and Transport Minister for Energy and Mining The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS: Yell, yell— Members interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Order! The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS House of Assembly West Torrens Minister for Infrastructure and Transport Minister for Energy and Mining The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS: They can yell all they like— Mr Patterson interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Member for Morphett! The Hon. V.A. Tarzia interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Member for Hartley! The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS House of Assembly West Torrens Minister for Infrastructure and Transport Minister for Energy and Mining The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS: They can yell all they like. Mr Brown interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Member for Florey! The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS House of Assembly West Torrens Minister for Infrastructure and Transport Minister for Energy and Mining The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS: They can scream, they can interject, they can complain. Every single thing— Members interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Order! The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS House of Assembly West Torrens Minister for Infrastructure and Transport Minister for Energy and Mining The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS: —the members opposite have touched in the NEM has turned to disaster—has absolutely turned to disaster. What we are attempting to do is to find a technology, develop a new generator that can actually firm renewable energy not at the risk cost that thermal generators price their retail pricing at but actually at a price that would actually put downward pressure on electricity prices. They did not build the solar thermal plant they promised they would complete on entering office in 2018. They said nothing about it—gone to history. They promised they would never privatise ETSA—gone to history. And now, after they privatised our emergency back-up generator, they dare to complain about this state government building new capacity. Members interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Order! The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS House of Assembly West Torrens Minister for Infrastructure and Transport Minister for Energy and Mining The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS: In the entire time members opposite were in government not one new merchant investment was made in thermal energy in this state—not one dollar, and do you know why? Because no-one would invest— Members interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Order! Member for West Torrens, there is— Mr Patterson interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Member for Morphett! Members interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Order! The member for Morialta, under 134. The Hon. J.A.W. GARDNER House of Assembly Morialta Deputy Leader of the Opposition The Hon. J.A.W. GARDNER: Standing order 98. We are more than halfway through the question and the minister is debating. Members interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Order! Interjections are continuing to my left and right contrary to the standing orders. Members interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Order! I have the point of order. There is some force in the matters that have been raised. I bring the minister to the question. Minister. The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS House of Assembly West Torrens Minister for Infrastructure and Transport Minister for Energy and Mining The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS: When we decided to embark on the Hydrogen Jobs Plan the plan is this: there is an oversupply of renewable energy, and that negative demand in South Australia is reaching 16 megawatts and sometimes goes into the negative region. Our opponents' plan was to just simply disable that renewable energy and not have it submitted to the grid. Our view is that it is an opportunity. Our plan— Mr Patterson interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: The member for Morphett is warned. Members interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Order! Mr Patterson interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Member for Morphett, you are warned for a second time. The minister has the call. Minister. The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS House of Assembly West Torrens Minister for Infrastructure and Transport Minister for Energy and Mining The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS: Our plan is to use that excess renewable energy to manufacture hydrogen, store that energy and once we store it we use that energy to firm renewable energy assets in the state to try to put in lower prices for wholesale power prices which have an impact on retail power prices. Members opposite are fundamentally opposed to any intervention in the National Electricity Market. The Hon. J.A.W. GARDNER House of Assembly Morialta Deputy Leader of the Opposition The Hon. J.A.W. GARDNER: Point of order, sir. The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Order! Minister, there is a point of order from the member for Morialta, which I will hear under 134. The Hon. J.A.W. GARDNER House of Assembly Morialta Deputy Leader of the Opposition The Hon. J.A.W. GARDNER: Standing order 98. The question was directed to the hydrogen power plant and whether it will reduce power prices for South Australia. When the minister talks about the opposition he is debating. An honourable member House of Assembly An honourable member: Talk about laissez-faire! The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Order! I will listen carefully. Minister, come to the question. The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS House of Assembly West Torrens Minister for Infrastructure and Transport Minister for Energy and Mining The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS: By offering that firming service our generators will be able to firm renewable energy, which means that wholesale power prices impact retail power pricing, and by having lower bids in the wholesale market and dropping the wholesale market over time sees an impact on retail prices. But fundamentally, as the Premier said at the last state election, members opposite promised a decrease in power prices that never eventuated—not once. Politicians who— Members interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Order! Members interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Order! I am anticipating 98. The Hon. J.A.W. GARDNER House of Assembly Morialta Deputy Leader of the Opposition The Hon. J.A.W. GARDNER: Standing order 98, sir. The Liberal Party delivered a $300 reduction in power prices. The minister is debating. Mr Patterson interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Order! Member for Morphett, I can see that this matter animates you, but you are on two warnings. Members interjecting: The Speaker House of Assembly The SPEAKER: Order! I have the point of order. There is some force in it. We are very close to the minister's time being exhausted. Minister. The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS House of Assembly West Torrens Minister for Infrastructure and Transport Minister for Energy and Mining The Hon. A. KOUTSANTONIS: Our aim is to use our generator to firm renewable resources for industrial purposes. We want to see wholesale power prices decrease. As wholesale power prices decrease so will retail prices.